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I came across this posting on Confguide.com

FAO Oxford fans r.e. Trevor Lambert
ChrisVessey CUFC Mon 2-Oct-2006 17:00:57
authenticated user: CHRISVESSEY (id=7434)
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[ Message 585910, a follow-up to none ]

Hi there,

We understand you sent this letter to our 'wonderful' police officer who seems to decide whether our games should be played on a Friday or Saturday...

PC Trevor George
Football Liaison Officer
Parkside Police Station
Cambridge CB1 1JG

11 September 2006

Dear PC George

Cambridge United vs Oxford United, 20 October 2006

OxVox, The Oxford United Supporters Trust, wishes to express its disappointment with Cambridgeshire Police's decision to insist on moving the forthcoming game between Cambridge United and Oxford United from Saturday 21 October to the evening of Friday 20th.

We are unconvinced by the public reasons given for this change, which I understand mainly relate to your view that the risk of public disorder (and hence policing requirements to reduce risk) is higher on the Saturday than on the Friday.

According to media reports, this decision has been taken contrary to the wishes of Oxford United, and also of Thames Valley Police who did not appear to anticipate any problems with scheduling the fixture for the Saturday.

Oxford United supporters are generally responsible for a low level of football-related incidents. This match is one that many fans will have been looking forward to, but the difficult journey on a busy Friday evening is likely to reduce substantially the number of away supporters who are able to travel to the match and arrive in good time. Essentially anyone wishing to attend will have to take time off work. In turn this will mean a lower crowd and reduced income for Cambridge United, whilst there will remain substantial policing costs to them.

Saturday football is an important national tradition which is being eroded in many ways, and it is frustrating to see it happening needlessly on occasions such as this. At higher levels in the game there are other factors at work e.g. TV requirements which reduce the number of Saturday games, but at Conference level one would have hoped that the roots of the game would be better protected.

We appreciate the decision has now been taken and you are unlikely to revoke it. However we would be interested to receive your comments on the background to the decision.

With best wishes

Yours sincerely


Trevor Lambert
Chair, OxVox



I was wondering whether Mr George has sent a reply? If he has would it be possible to forward it onto me at chrisvessey@hotmail.com, as we are also very eager for this not to happen again.

Thanks for any help!

Chris

Trev (for some unknown reason) is generally a little timorous of posting on this forum so youÔÇÖd be better off pushing this point on TiU.

Maybe somebody else would be so kind as to put it up on TiU as I don't indulge over there.

I had some emails correspondence with Cambs Police, and the reason they gave came down to regarding Oxford fans as hooligans and that Cambs residents wouldn't be safe with Oxford fans around.

When I pointed out that the same would apply on a Friday night, and that at the last fixture, contrary to their published statements, only 2 supposedly Oxford fans had been arrested (and that was in the town not near the ground), and that their decision might have more to do with their officers wanting their weekend free, they refused to correspond further on the matter. They then demanded to know my name and address and contact details and all but accused me of having criminal motive for asking these perfectly reasonable questions. Despite giving my details and despite further attempts to correspond, they have now breached their own rules in not replying to correspondence within 5 days of receipt.

It is no wonder that despite the admirable work that many police officers do, that some deride the police force when they display this sort of attitude.

It is totally possible that the football intelligence is more intelligent than we give it credit.

Apparently there was a major incident before the York game last Saturday in Blackbird Leys involving about 100 York and Oxford &quotfans&quot. According to Oxford football intelligence officer, Huw James it was the worst violence he had seen in the last 2 years.

Our newly found position of &quottop dog&quot in this league may be bringing the wrong sort of &quotsupporters&quot out of the woodwork. According to Huw James the people involved were in their 30s and 40s.

&quotMally&quot wrote:It is totally possible that the football intelligence is more intelligent than we give it credit.

Apparently there was a major incident before the York game last Saturday in Blackbird Leys involving about 100 York and Oxford &quotfans&quot. According to Oxford football intelligence officer, Huw James it was the worst violence he had seen in the last 2 years.

Our newly found position of &quottop dog&quot in this league may be bringing the wrong sort of &quotsupporters&quot out of the woodwork. According to Huw James the people involved were in their 30s and 40s.

My understanding of this event is that a coach of York fans arrived and piled into the Priory with one very specific intent. I've been told by someone who was in there that the Oxford fans were completely passive until the arrival of the York fans.

I don't doubt that our league position will begin to attract the unwelcome elements again, and indeed I believe there were known Oxford hoolies at the Stafford game.

I question why known hoolis aren't given an order to attend a police station at kick off time.

That may well have happened but the Oxford Mail report an incident that started in Cowley and moved into Blackbird Leys. They only mention trouble at the Priory after the game. They also say that &quotIt is very likely that further arrests will be made particularly of those from Oxford&quot.

Whatever the events on Saturday though with our new found success and bigger crowds there is a real danger of us also attracting the hooli elements back in bigger numbers this year. Perhaps there was some specific intelligence relating to Cambridge that played a part in the decision to move the game. Which for the rest of us is, of course, a real pain.

I think there are known hooligans and there are people who have been convicted of a football related offence and served with a banning order. Unfortunately unitl the known hoolis are arrested and charged for a football related offence there's nothing that can be done to keep them away from games.

I've got a very bad feeling about Aldershot home and away.

&quotMally&quot wrote:That may well have happened but the Oxford Mail report an incident that started in Cowley and moved into Blackbird Leys. They only mention trouble at the Priory after the game. They also say that &quotIt is very likely that further arrests will be made particularly of those from Oxford&quot.

Whatever the events on Saturday though with our new found success and bigger crowds there is a real danger of us also attracting the hooli elements back in bigger numbers this year. Perhaps there was some specific intelligence relating to Cambridge that played a part in the decision to move the game. Which for the rest of us is, of course, a real pain.

I think there are known hooligans and there are people who have been convicted of a football related offence and served with a banning order. Unfortunately unitl the known hoolis are arrested and charged for a football related offence there's nothing that can be done to keep them away from games.

I've got a very bad feeling about Aldershot home and away.

Nothing really happened on Saturday, it's all been blown out of proportions.

I wasn in the BlackBird, and sure enough, at about 2.30, a lot of known 'faces' from the past and present showed up with reports that York had between 20-40 lads on the Cowley Road, about to catch the bus up here.

Sure enough, they did turn up, but by the time they'd had chance to get off their bus and the Oxford lads had run down to meet them where the buses turn just before the Blackbird, the police ahd arrived and apart from one bottle being chucked, a few York running away and one or two 'handbags', it was hardly a mass riot that Huw James is making it out to be.

In fact, had this useless man managed to stop them getting on the bus to BBL, then even less would have happened. Although there will always be some intent on causing trouble, sometimes the police let it happen so they can then 'crack down' on the trouble-makers, rather than prevent an easily-preventable incident in the first place!

&quotSeñor Fantástico Ox&quot wrote:

&quotMally&quot wrote:That may well have happened but the Oxford Mail report an incident that started in Cowley and moved into Blackbird Leys. They only mention trouble at the Priory after the game. They also say that &quotIt is very likely that further arrests will be made particularly of those from Oxford&quot.

Whatever the events on Saturday though with our new found success and bigger crowds there is a real danger of us also attracting the hooli elements back in bigger numbers this year. Perhaps there was some specific intelligence relating to Cambridge that played a part in the decision to move the game. Which for the rest of us is, of course, a real pain.

I think there are known hooligans and there are people who have been convicted of a football related offence and served with a banning order. Unfortunately unitl the known hoolis are arrested and charged for a football related offence there's nothing that can be done to keep them away from games.

I've got a very bad feeling about Aldershot home and away.

Nothing really happened on Saturday, it's all been blown out of proportions.

I wasn in the BlackBird, and sure enough, at about 2.30, a lot of known 'faces' from the past and present showed up with reports that York had between 20-40 lads on the Cowley Road, about to catch the bus up here.

Sure enough, they did turn up, but by the time they'd had chance to get off their bus and the Oxford lads had run down to meet them where the buses turn just before the Blackbird, the police ahd arrived and apart from one bottle being chucked, a few York running away and one or two 'handbags', it was hardly a mass riot that Huw James is making it out to be.

In fact, had this useless man managed to stop them getting on the bus to BBL, then even less would have happened. Although there will always be some intent on causing trouble, sometimes the police let it happen so they can then 'crack down' on the trouble-makers, rather than prevent an easily-preventable incident in the first place!

If PC Paul Philips had still been in charge of football liaison then this would not have been so blown up in the media.

Given that he's a copper he's still quite cool, imho.

Not trying to condone any of this but if York fans had not turned up with trouble in mind nothing would have happened.

&quotBaboo&quot wrote:Not trying to condone any of this but if York fans had not turned up with trouble in mind nothing would have happened.

This is very true, though I also condemn the actions of the hoolis. They are not supporters as they are not here to watch the game. The trouble they cause is often outside or away from the ground when the match is taking place, so they are not supporters. The problem is of course that they organise themselves in alignment with football matches which gives the impression of them being supporters. And before someone mentions it, the wearing of club colours by some hoolis is in my view more an extension of tribalry than support of a football team.

On the police intelligence point, I believe TVP have already publicly stated that they have no objections to the game being played on Saturday afternoon. Furthermore, if hoolis are intent on trouble, it will make little difference if the game is on a Saturday afternoon or Friday evening.

In my view, the Cambridge switch is purely down to officers not wanting to work on the Saturday. Because of the size of our support, rather than a handful of officers' weekends being affected, it becomes more than a hundred having their weekends affected.

Is it possible that within the ranks of Cambridgeshire Poilce there are a majority who have refused to work the match on moral grounds?

After game 14 tomorrow the Saturday tally will stand at 6 (a sorry state of affairs for a hard working exile like myself) - oh for yesteryear when the thin blue line needed the Saturday overtime!!

Then again on the plus side at least the TVP tax payers amongst you got see the Helicopter and mounted section last week.

To divert this subject a bit.

What was the ridiculous number of Police at Stafford all about.

Some lessons in how to extract information for the benefit of OV and fans in general, if that’s ok with the folk who’s Chair never comes on this I-board..

The police are classed as a public authority in the eyes of the law so they are subject to the Freedom of Information Act. If you care to use those four magic words in any correspondence with them you will get a formal response (of one sort or another) within 20 working days, and that’s guaranteed.

What’s more, sometimes you even get a proper and informative answer so long as you ask nicely enough and make out that you know how the FOI Act works.

&quotBaboo&quot wrote:Not trying to condone any of this but if York fans had not turned up with trouble in mind nothing would have happened.

or indeed, had the &quotOxford lads&quot not &quotrun down to meet them&quot!