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Re: Should the fans take the blame?
Posted: Wed May 07, 2014 9:42 am
by SmileyMan
ty cobb wrote:Jake Wright is another case in point. One of our best most consistant players for years and a Wembley hero. In what may well be his last game for us he got a earful of abuse. When he busted a gut to clear a shot off the line you could see him turn to the crowd and gave some back. It is pretty clear the club captain does not think much of us and I can't blame him.
Since he's captain, why not try giving an earful to some of the other players who were losing the games? Did he expect the fans to be blowing him kisses and offering up their daughters?
I'm sorry, but if you're a professional footballer who can't win a game, you're going to get booed. Suck it up.
Re: Should the fans take the blame?
Posted: Wed May 07, 2014 11:02 am
by Brahma Bull
Jimski wrote:Not sure how one reconciles these two positions:
"Lenagan also accepted he had made mistakes this season and pointed to the Wilder situation and then the length of time it took to replace him."
"He did say that if he had his time again he would make the same decisions for the benefit of the club."
If it was a mistake, why do things the same again?
I also found those two statements rather odd and conflicting. I think his mistake(s) remark relates to the time taken to seek and appoint a replacement. Whilst I think that the end of the Wilder era was inevitable (he eluded to that) and what he was actually trying to say was he would do the same thing again - holding off negotiations etc -
when people were/are suggesting that was a mistake too.
Re: Should the fans take the blame?
Posted: Wed May 07, 2014 11:39 am
by Kernow Yellow
Brahma Bull wrote:He went on [...] that Wilder and OUFC were in effect coming to the end. He added we need to take one step back to move two steps forward. He did say that if he had his time again he would make the same decisions for the benefit of the club.
I'm sorry, but if he knew Wilder and OUFC were coming to an end he should have taken the decision to part ways at the end of last season. If he had done that there would have been no need to take the step back at all, as a new man could have come in and put his squad together for a full season's campaign. If, even with the benefit of hindsight, he thinks he'd do the same things all over again then that's ridiculous and I'm frankly worried that he's making such important decisions tbh.
Of course we all want to see the two steps forward that IL talks about, but if past performance of his progress promises is anything to go by, I'm not going to take them as a given.
Re: Should the fans take the blame?
Posted: Wed May 07, 2014 1:54 pm
by Matt D
Snake wrote:Replacing Kelvin with your own kids, fans raising money to fund players and DIY decorations to the stadium like flags and a bit of yellow, raising prices above inflation or keeping them stable when a 5% VAT reduction occurred, reducing the wage bill, youth over experienced loanees when injuries hit, and above all the situation with Wilder (like him or not) must have saved a few quid.
While IL still runs a ‘big name’ Rugby club the Minchery Farm setup has become an expensive and fanciful distraction/hobby with no escape route other than selling low as he’s not going to get those millions of pounds back now – and the longer this situation goes on the further away from the promised land Oxford United become as the financial gap increases each year -
http://www.theguardian.com/football/201 ... david-conn
To be honest I think the guy refuses to admit he’s failed, cuts his losses and moves on. He paid £2m (plus a quid) for the club, but it’s probably now worth half of that given the licence deal he authorised his solicitors to sign on 21st March 2006.
you can add andy melville to your list.
there's a difference between corner cutting and cost savings. reducing the outgoings of an organisation, particularly one that has been regularly losing the sums that OUFC has been for the last few years, is not something to dismiss out of hand. the question is what is then done to carry out whatever job that outgoing was intended to achieve. so if the youth players coming through are as good, or better, than the loan players we've had in recent years, i'd say that's cost saving, not corner cutting.
whatever IL thinks of the job he's done at OUFC so far, i can't see him moving on. the reality of the situation is that he can either write off the money he's put in (unlikely IMHO) or hope someone's nuts enough to give him that money/a good wedge of it (very unlikely IMHO). if not, he's going to have to try and bring the club's books into some kind of order and deliver success on the pitch.
Re: Should the fans take the blame?
Posted: Wed May 07, 2014 4:13 pm
by joepoolman
ty cobb wrote:For the first time in many many years we had an excellent manager at this club. We let him go far too easily.
I think Wilder is an excellent manager and I never wanted him to leave, but something that really dawned on me on Saturday is that this is a guy that walked away from our club, justifiably or not, and left us in the shit, in the short term at least. So screw Wilder, I'm grateful for everything he did but he walked away, and I wouldn't have felt bad for him if we'd put them down, not in the slightest.
Re: Should the fans take the blame?
Posted: Wed May 07, 2014 10:11 pm
by Brahma Bull
Joe Hi. You were there on Sunday night at the awards, have I accurately relayed the speech from Lenagan?
Re: Should the fans take the blame?
Posted: Wed May 07, 2014 10:55 pm
by Snake
Matt D wrote:Whatever IL thinks of the job he's done at OUFC so far, I can't see him moving on. the reality of the situation is that he can either write off the money he's put in (unlikely IMHO) or hope someone's nuts enough to give him that money/a good wedge of it (very unlikely IMHO). If not, he's going to have to try and bring the club's books into some kind of order and deliver success on the pitch.
Q1. Define “good wedge”. i.e. what is Oxford United as a club really worth without a ground?
Q2. How much money do you reckon it would take to buy the club and the whole of the surrounding owned/leased/franchised areas and doing a total buy out from Firoka?
Q3. Do you think that there is no consortium or forward thinking entrepreneur on this planet who would take on the above mentioned enterprise with Oxford United (a currently failing club with the massive publicity potential and financial incentive to make it better

at its core?
Re: Should the fans take the blame?
Posted: Thu May 08, 2014 12:00 pm
by ty cobb
SmileyMan wrote:ty cobb wrote:Jake Wright is another case in point. One of our best most consistant players for years and a Wembley hero. In what may well be his last game for us he got a earful of abuse. When he busted a gut to clear a shot off the line you could see him turn to the crowd and gave some back. It is pretty clear the club captain does not think much of us and I can't blame him.
Since he's captain, why not try giving an earful to some of the other players who were losing the games? Did he expect the fans to be blowing him kisses and offering up their daughters?
I'm sorry, but if you're a professional footballer who can't win a game, you're going to get booed. Suck it up.
So the captain of our play off winning team, one of our most consistant classy players over the last few seasons is playing in possibly his last game for the club which has nothing riding on it for us and you expect him to suck up the abuse he recieved that day.
#unitedwestand.
Re: Should the fans take the blame?
Posted: Thu May 08, 2014 6:27 pm
by joepoolman
Brahma Bull wrote:Joe Hi. You were there on Sunday night at the awards, have I accurately relayed the speech from Lenagan?
This aimed at me? If so I wasn't there, struggling to pay for ST let alone posh awards do ticket.
Re: Should the fans take the blame?
Posted: Thu May 08, 2014 9:53 pm
by Matt D
Snake wrote:Q1. Define “good wedge”. i.e. what is Oxford United as a club really worth without a ground?
Q2. How much money do you reckon it would take to buy the club and the whole of the surrounding owned/leased/franchised areas and doing a total buy out from Firoka?
Q3. Do you think that there is no consortium or forward thinking entrepreneur on this planet who would take on the above mentioned enterprise with Oxford United (a currently failing club with the massive publicity potential and financial incentive to make it better

at its core?
what i think it's worth is not really at stake here. it's what any willing vendor thinks it's worth.
as for consortia or forward-thinking entrepreneurs on this planet, that's a pretty big net to cast, and much bigger than my limited knowledge would stretch to... so yes, it's perfectly possible, but i don't see any on the horizon at the moment. do you?
Re: Should the fans take the blame?
Posted: Fri May 09, 2014 3:40 pm
by Snake
Matt D wrote:Snake wrote:Q1. Define “good wedge”. i.e. what is Oxford United as a club really worth without a ground?
Q2. How much money do you reckon it would take to buy the club and the whole of the surrounding owned/leased/franchised areas and doing a total buy out from Firoka?
Q3. Do you think that there is no consortium or forward thinking entrepreneur on this planet who would take on the above mentioned enterprise with Oxford United (a currently failing club with the massive publicity potential and financial incentive to make it better

at its core?
What I think it's worth is not really at stake here. It's what any willing vendor thinks it's worth.
As for consortia or forward-thinking entrepreneurs on this planet, that's a pretty big net to cast, and much bigger than my limited knowledge would stretch to... so yes, it's perfectly possible, but I don't see any on the horizon at the moment. Do you?
Pedant alert - IL is the vendor
I reckon to any BUYER it’s probably worth what Ian paid for it. i.e. £2m plus compound inflation minus a pay off to Firoka to renegotiate the ridiculous lease.
And no, unless WPL say they want to sell no one will put their head over the horizon and ask to buy for fear of looking too keen and inflating the price. However, lots of football clubs change hands – just look at Eastleigh....
And this -
http://www.ukbusinessforums.co.uk/threa ... lub.78966/
Re: Should the fans take the blame?
Posted: Sat May 10, 2014 6:26 pm
by The Enforcer
joepoolman wrote:posh awards do ticket.
I hope this was held at McDonald's to be in line with the need to make savings and as an appropriate venue to match the end of season form.
Re: Should the fans take the blame?
Posted: Sun May 11, 2014 9:09 pm
by SmileyMan
The Enforcer wrote:joepoolman wrote:posh awards do ticket.
I hope this was held at McDonald's to be in line with the need to make savings and as an appropriate venue to match the end of season form.
McDonald's is an incredibly well run organisation that constantly outmaneuvres its competitors and generates enormous profits from appealing to legions of loyal fans.
Re: Should the fans take the blame?
Posted: Tue May 13, 2014 8:58 pm
by The Enforcer
Aye, but cheap and cheerful nonetheless.