Rubbish and Dustbins

[x586]

My God - last night managed the dualism of being shocking and boring - laughing stock material for any neutral who managed to watch more than two minutes of it.

Brevett: out, immediately. Awful.
Burgess: out, today or tomorrow. Showing the reasons why he spent half a season on the bench at R&ampD before we got him.
Tardif: out, today or tomorrow. Couple of good saves, but should have been punished for flapping / running out and not collecting on a couple of occasions.

Felt sorry for Grebis &amp Duffy.

Otherwise, a combo of journeymen, reservists and rubbish we should have got rid of after relegation.

As for that formation, well .......

Not lifeboat alert yet, but if that's a yardstick of where we're at half way through this season, next season might be a bit 'difficult', again. FFS.

[Matt D]

My main reason for keeping Smith is despite this run of form he's still a good, experience manager with a solid record and he's only been in this job for 9 months, I don't think that's long enough to build a new team from scratch. There is a generally accepted doomsday scenario that if we don't go up this season then that's it, but surely with the wage cap in place and our good attendances this year then we should still have a decent, even without the parachute payment, wage budget next season? I think for winning the league this year he'd either have needed every signing to be a success (which rarely happens, especially lower down the leagues) or he'd have needed his first choice side to stay fit pretty much all season (likewise).

I think the key to it is for everyone (manager, board and fans) not to panic, there was enough of that on the pitch last night.

agreed.

despite the awful state we're in, perhaps the stubborness that's not accepted that things need to change will now come to an end. with this much experience in management, i simply don't believe that jim smith's run out of ideas, and it seems to me a terrible idea to gamble on another manager now.

i don't know how much responsibility awford holds for the current performances less than he's being accused of by some fans i suspect. but if a scapegoat is required to pacify the fans and instill the required sense of change in the players, i'll load him up and pack him off to the wilderness myself.

[Frank]

What a disgrace last night. Most of it has been said, but &quotwhy oh why&quot, does Smith and co stand a point and chat for ages before bringing Yemi on. Clueless and I think he has lost it bigtime!

Evenyually when even Smith realised that Yemi should be on, Yemi didn't have a shirt on - so a mad panic in the dugout. Very professional!

Im sure the ex-oxford lads enjoyed that result and its a shame that Smithy didn't get Jamie Cook back when he had the chance.

See you Saturday - unlike a fair few of the glory hunters who left early yesterday

[Ancient Colin]

I'm at a loss to know how you can't place the blame on the managment though. It's their squad and the players they have brought here, their system, their motivation, their training. I'd take the &quotit takes time to develop a squad&quot line if:

(a) there were any signs of improvement inthe standard of play and the style of play - as opposed to obvious signs of deterioration
(b) any sense of a coherent strategy in the recruitment of players
(c) any evidence of tactical awareness either before a match (how do they play and how are we going to deal with it/exploit it) or in a match (what's going wrong and how are we going to fix it).

In the absence of that, my disquiet at the original appointment has turned into a deep chasm of disillusion.

I've been trying to keep away from the keyboard in the hope that my mood would improve. It hasn't. Was that any less clueless than under Rix?

[Isaac]

I'm at a loss to know how you can't place the blame on the managment though. It's their squad and the players they have brought here, their system, their motivation, their training. I'd take the &quotit takes time to develop a squad&quot line if:

(a) there were any signs of improvement inthe standard of play and the style of play - as opposed to obvious signs of deterioration
(b) any sense of a coherent strategy in the recruitment of players
(c) any evidence of tactical awareness either before a match (how do they play and how are we going to deal with it/exploit it) or in a match (what's going wrong and how are we going to fix it).

In the absence of that, my disquiet at the original appointment has turned into a deep chasm of disillusion.

I've been trying to keep away from the keyboard in the hope that my mood would improve. It hasn't. Was that any less clueless than under Rix?

I'm not saying that you can't place any blame on the management. It's not black and white. Of course they're culpable for some of the problems, but so culpable that they should be sacked (or moved upstairs, or whatever) and our best chance of recovery is to replace them with someone new and rebuild once again?

I'd have more sympathy for the &quotthis is their team&quot line of argument if Smith and co had been here longer than 9 months. I think to expect a manager to get every signing perfect straight away is unrealistic. The Ferguson example is a cliche, but it's valuable.

Tactical awareness is largely irrelevant in games like last night, if the team can't pass, can't tackle and generally look scared playing 4-4-2 or 4-3-3 or 5-3-2 would make little difference. I agree that I'd prefer 4-4-2 because I suspect the players would be more comfortable with it, but if you think that 4-4-2 would magically have made them play that much better last night then I suspect you're horribly wrong. The motivation/confidence issue is certainly something the management need to fix quickly though.

As for the strategy of player recruitment, I think Smith decided to play 5-3-2 at the start of the season and has now (after a brief period of largely unsuccesful tinkering with 4-3-3 and 4-4-2) has gone back to it since it worked very well earlier in the season. His recruitment of players recently has largely been to cover injuries.

I've read this back and it does look like I'm attempting to defend the indefensible performance last night when I'm really not, I'm just wary that an over-reaction from the fans could see us heading down the familiar route of trying to fix all our problems by demanding the manager gets the sack.

[GodalmingYellow]

I'm at a loss to know how you can't place the blame on the managment though. It's their squad and the players they have brought here, their system, their motivation, their training. I'd take the &quotit takes time to develop a squad&quot line if:

(a) there were any signs of improvement inthe standard of play and the style of play - as opposed to obvious signs of deterioration
(b) any sense of a coherent strategy in the recruitment of players
(c) any evidence of tactical awareness either before a match (how do they play and how are we going to deal with it/exploit it) or in a match (what's going wrong and how are we going to fix it).

In the absence of that, my disquiet at the original appointment has turned into a deep chasm of disillusion.

I've been trying to keep away from the keyboard in the hope that my mood would improve. It hasn't. Was that any less clueless than under Rix?

I agree with most of this.

I'm still not in favour of getting rid of Jim Smith's experience. That surely wouldn't be a good thing. But as I said on here last week, the first team set up needs a new spark in terms of approach and motivation, which I personally think could come from Patterson working as assistant Manager.

We still need a left back and left winger.

We need to learn quickly how to deal with teams who will muscle us off the ball, which will be virtually everyone.

I completely agrre that this was worse than anything under Rix or Kemp, mainly because those teams were playing at a higher level than we are now. In relative terms they are all much of a muchness.

The season is not lost however. We are very fortunate, that D&ampR and others are selling their family silver. We can still do this. But it is down to Merry and Co taking the right decisions to determine what we do or don't achieve.

[GodalmingYellow]

I don't agree that changing the formation won't help Isaac.

Sure it won't be a magical transformation, but if it suits the players better, and the opposition don't find it so easy to stop our &quotsystem&quot, then the difference could be important. It is only 1 of several factors that need to be rectified though.

[Isaac]

I don't agree that changing the formation won't help Isaac.

Sure it won't be a magical transformation, but if it suits the players better, and the opposition don't find it so easy to stop our &quotsystem&quot, then the difference could be important. It is only 1 of several factors that need to be rectified though.

I'm not saying it won't help - it probably would, I'm just not sure it'd have helped last night since so many of the basics were lacking.

[DLT]

Name one signing since last March who has met expectations.

I can go with Pettefer being a plus. All the others are negatives for me.

Hatswell outclassed Gilchrist in spirit, leadership and example tohis team last night.

I am now at the stage where I am praying that we loan Powelly back from Didcot for the rest of the season.

On one leg he has more class and ability than the rest ofour current squad.

[neilw]

I was hoping that I'd be able to share comment by now, but no, unfortunately I'm still lost for words. Can't quite believe what I witnessed last night. I can only conclude that there really is something of substance in the gypsy curse. No other possible explanation.

[Isaac]

Name one signing since last March who has met expectations.

I can go with Pettefer being a plus. All the others are negatives for me.

Hatswell outclassed Gilchrist in spirit, leadership and example tohis team last night.

I am now at the stage where I am praying that we loan Powelly back from Didcot for the rest of the season.

On one leg he has more class and ability than the rest ofour current squad.

Up until December, nearly all were plusses, except Hutchinson. I'd say overall, on the season so far Duffy, Pettefer, Anaclet have generally been plusses. Gilchrist for me has broken even, as has Rose in his short time here. Hutchinson a steady disappointment and I haven't seen enough of Robinson, Santos, Day and Grebis to judge (nor Coombes, obviously).

If we're bringing back Powell we may as well sound Beauchamp and Bob Ford too.

[Ancient Colin]

Johnson? Brevett? Slabber? For much of the season Anaclet's been a liability. Day has moments, but is he what we want/need? Gilchrist is painfully slow, his distribution is awful and his inability to mark at setpieces is contributing to the problems - the absence of Wilmott really highlights that. That was the first time I've seen Rose, and it was pretty hard to imagine Man U having him as a professional with &quotpassing&quot like that.

[DLT]

Name one signing since last March who has met expectations.

I can go with Pettefer being a plus. All the others are negatives for me.

Hatswell outclassed Gilchrist in spirit, leadership and example tohis team last night.

I am now at the stage where I am praying that we loan Powelly back from Didcot for the rest of the season.

On one leg he has more class and ability than the rest ofour current squad.

Up until December, nearly all were plusses, except Hutchinson. I'd say overall, on the season so far Duffy, Pettefer, Anaclet have generally been plusses. Gilchrist for me has broken even, as has Rose in his short time here. Hutchinson a steady disappointment and I haven't seen enough of Robinson, Santos, Day and Grebis to judge (nor Coombes, obviously).

If we're bringing back Powell we may as well sound Beauchamp and Bob Ford too.

I know I am very much a half empty type of fan these days but I have never bubbled with excitement this season, even when we were 8 points clear.

I have this huge negative that without Jimbo we would have survived in the league. He brought in some incredible dross in players likethe Italian Gelding and Horseshit. They replaced players who had shown under Patterson a desire tofight for the cause.

With Gilly you have to balance contribution against his drawings. To me he looks overweight and going through the motions.

If Burgess had taken the penalties all season then Duffy would have been shown the door by now. He has only shown it for me away at FGR.

Rose mystifies me, what do you lot see in him?

[Isaac]

Johnson? Brevett? Slabber? For much of the season Anaclet's been a liability. Day has moments, but is he what we want/need? Gilchrist is painfully slow, his distribution is awful and his inability to mark at setpieces is contributing to the problems - the absence of Wilmott really highlights that. That was the first time I've seen Rose, and it was pretty hard to imagine Man U having him as a professional with &quotpassing&quot like that.

Johnson started well but the injury seems to have turned him crap. Brevett has no legs so he's on the negatives. As with Slabber, although he only played a handful of games.

So what's that, 40/60 &quotgood&quot/&quotbad&quot signings so far. Anyway, I'm getting side-tracked. - you're all probably right, let's start again with a new manager. Constant change of manager has proven to be a winning strategy for us over the recent past.

[Matt D]

if the signings have all been bad, how do you account for the start we had to our season? it seems a long time ago, but we did play well at times, didn't we? (he asks in an increasingly hysterical manner...

for me this has been a good side, but a loss of legs in some cases, and confidence throughout the side, to an unbelieveable extent, has left the season floundering. i can believe that some of the younger players can lose confidence and belief easily in a season, but we have an experienced management team, and experience in the side.

thinking the management team should take the blame is not necessarily the same as thinking they should go now.