Engerland

[GodalmingYellow]

Maybe I am missing something, but I don't understand why Capello thinks it is acceptable for someone accused of racism to remain as Captain of their country.

In fact I would go further and say John Terry should be suspended from any involvement with the England football team until such time as the allegations are shown to be untrue.

[John Byrne's Underpants]

The key word here is 'accused'. John Terry hasn't, as yet, been found guilty of anything. Whatever happened to 'innocent until proven guilty'?

Whether they intended it or not, by removing JT from the captaincy role, the FA have, effectively, tried and convicted him in the eyes of the publc. I've no liking of the man and never wanted him reinstated as captain in the first place, but he's entitled to his day in court before we all start condemning him.

[SteMerritt]

John Terry, of course, should have resigned the captaincy himself, saying &quotI am innocent of these charges, and I will prove this in court, but I feel the current accusations sit at odds with what the FA are trying to achieve with regards to kicking racism out of football, a stance I wholeheartedly endorse. Therefore I with much regret resign as England football captain.&quot

Not hard is it, and something he would have received a lot of respect for doing.

[SmileyMan]

Innocent until proven guilty. Although the FA should (and in fact used to) have a rule that a player charged by the police cannot play for England. Simple and unambiguous.

They got rid of it when Gerrard got in that bother over the fight in the nightclub.

The police and the CPS aren't blame-free either, taking such a stupid amount of time to bring the charges.

[Mooro]

I've said this before, but Id love to see a one strike and you are out policy applied to all England players - doesnt even have to be a criminal offence, just any behaviour that sets a bad example to young children growing up.


If all players know that racism, violence, adultery, drink driving, drugs, etc, etc, mean that you will never play for England again, then it might actually encourage them to take the additional responsibility to not only ensure they dont actively misbehave, but also ensure that they do not put themselves into positions where such things may be brought out.

Then we can have a squad that we can get behind, rather than the current bunch of reprobates....

[Dartford Ox]

Innocent until proven guilty. Although the FA should (and in fact used to) have a rule that a player charged by the police cannot play for England. Simple and unambiguous.

They got rid of it when Gerrard got in that bother over the fight in the nightclub.

The police and the CPS aren't blame-free either, taking such a stupid amount of time to bring the charges.

I read somewhere, can't remember where, that the original hearing was scheduled for late March. Chelsea FC appealed stating their run-in to the Premiership title would be disrupted and an adjournment until the summer was granted by a Judge.

That judge was obviously not made aware of the furore it would cause.

[Dr Bob]

John Terry, of course, should have resigned the captaincy himself, saying &quotI am innocent of these charges, and I will prove this in court, but I feel the current accusations sit at odds with what the FA are trying to achieve with regards to kicking racism out of football, a stance I wholeheartedly endorse. Therefore I with much regret resign as England football captain.&quot

Not hard is it, and something he would have received a lot of respect for doing.

My thoughts exactly. Shame he lacks the wherewithal to recognise this.

[Andrewmaha]

I've said this before, but Id love to see a one strike and you are out policy applied to all England players - doesnt even have to be a criminal offence, just any behaviour that sets a bad example to young children growing up.


If all players know that racism, violence, adultery, drink driving, drugs, etc, etc, mean that you will never play for England again, then it might actually encourage them to take the additional responsibility to not only ensure they dont actively misbehave, but also ensure that they do not put themselves into positions where such things may be brought out.

Then we can have a squad that we can get behind, rather than the current bunch of reprobates....

LOL

The trouble with this is that the squad that you would get behind would be half full of players not capable of playing at international level.

Based on what I have read in the press or seen on the web there are quite a few cases that involve shagging, sniffing, drinking, fighting, gambling, speeding, bribing, tax evading.

Not all at the same time of course althout it would make for one hell of a party!

You would at least get Heskey back up front.

[pottersrightboot]

I've said this before, but Id love to see a one strike and you are out policy applied to all England players - doesnt even have to be a criminal offence, just any behaviour that sets a bad example to young children growing up.


If all players know that racism, violence, adultery, drink driving, drugs, etc, etc, mean that you will never play for England again, then it might actually encourage them to take the additional responsibility to not only ensure they dont actively misbehave, but also ensure that they do not put themselves into positions where such things may be brought out.

Then we can have a squad that we can get behind, rather than the current bunch of reprobates....

Ridiculous holier than thou attitude. They are footballers not applicants for the General Synod!

[pottersrightboot]

John Terry, of course, should have resigned the captaincy himself, saying &quotI am innocent of these charges, and I will prove this in court, but I feel the current accusations sit at odds with what the FA are trying to achieve with regards to kicking racism out of football, a stance I wholeheartedly endorse. Therefore I with much regret resign as England football captain.&quot

Not hard is it, and something he would have received a lot of respect for doing.

Good point. But he's a badly advised scumbag. Who might well be innocent to boot. And that's important.

I'm getting rather fed up with the 'court of public opinion' attitude. Last week Fred , this week Terry, who's next for the lynch mob?

Have your say ,call Victoria Derbyshire NOW....

[GodalmingYellow]

I thought this might stir up a good old ding dong!

The argument that John Terry is effectively being convicted by being stripped of the captaincy is nonsense in my view. the argument of innocent until proven guilty is a perfectly reasonable concept but has nothign to do with an argument about JT remaining as England captain or being available for selection even.

In any job, the employer has the responsibility to protect employees from discrimination.
In any job, the employer has the right to protect the credibility and good name of their business.
In any job, every employee has the responsibility to not behave in a manner which might be likely to adversely impact either of the above 2 scenarios.

It is normal for any employee accused of an offence such as this to be suspended, pending the outcome of a hearing. That JT has been charged, underlines that even further.

Suspending JT, which is removing the captaincy (and would be removing his availability for selection if the FA had a backbone) is normal and proper, and gives no indication of guilt whatsoever.

Suspension from duty is a neutral event.

If JT had honour to match his gob, he would have made himself not available for selection pending the outcome.

How on Earth is Rio ferdinand to be expected to play alongside John Terry. It is ridiculous.

In all honesty, I think JT should have been suspended at Chelsea as well.

If JT clears his name, he then would get to come back with his name unsullied.

[slappy]

So if JT had voluntarily stepped down as England captain, does it then follow that he should exempt himself from the national side altogether, and then surely he shouldn't be Chelsea captain either? And from there it is a small step to say he should be on gardening leave from all football until the court case is resolved.

[GodalmingYellow]

So if JT had voluntarily stepped down as England captain, does it then follow that he should exempt himself from the national side altogether, and then surely he shouldn't be Chelsea captain either? And from there it is a small step to say he should be on gardening leave from all football until the court case is resolved.

Yep. And JT should have done this voluntarily.

That the hearing is in July is the fault of Chelsea and JT, no one else.

If he had voluntarily stepped down straight away, it could all have been done and dusted in a few weeks.

[Kernow Yellow]

I thought this might stir up a good old ding dong!

The argument that John Terry is effectively being convicted by being stripped of the captaincy is nonsense in my view. the argument of innocent until proven guilty is a perfectly reasonable concept but has nothign to do with an argument about JT remaining as England captain or being available for selection even.

In any job, the employer has the responsibility to protect employees from discrimination.
In any job, the employer has the right to protect the credibility and good name of their business.
In any job, every employee has the responsibility to not behave in a manner which might be likely to adversely impact either of the above 2 scenarios.

It is normal for any employee accused of an offence such as this to be suspended, pending the outcome of a hearing. That JT has been charged, underlines that even further.

Suspending JT, which is removing the captaincy (and would be removing his availability for selection if the FA had a backbone) is normal and proper, and gives no indication of guilt whatsoever.

Suspension from duty is a neutral event.

If JT had honour to match his gob, he would have made himself not available for selection pending the outcome.

How on Earth is Rio ferdinand to be expected to play alongside John Terry. It is ridiculous.

I agree with every word of the above, GY. Well said.

I would like to emphasise the main point from your first post, which seems to have got lost in the debate - Capello had absolutely no business publicly criticising his employers, and to do so in defence of someone who has been charged by a court with racially abusing a fellow player (and a team-mate's brother!) is staggering. Mind you, given Capello's throwaway remarks about immigration last year, it's maybe not surprising he isn't treading more carefully in this debate. The FA should give him a bollocking at the very least.

I'm no fan of Rio Ferdinand as a person, but his reaction when asked if he would like to become England captain was very telling. As you say, any squad with him and John Terry in is going to be pretty disharmonious.

[Baboo]

I've said this before, but Id love to see a one strike and you are out policy applied to all England players - doesnt even have to be a criminal offence, just any behaviour that sets a bad example to young children growing up.


If all players know that racism, violence, adultery, drink driving, drugs, etc, etc, mean that you will never play for England again, then it might actually encourage them to take the additional responsibility to not only ensure they dont actively misbehave, but also ensure that they do not put themselves into positions where such things may be brought out.

Then we can have a squad that we can get behind, rather than the current bunch of reprobates....

Ridiculous holier than thou attitude. They are footballers not applicants for the General Synod!

Couldn't agree more with you prb.
etc etc - er what, dropping litter, going 2 mph over the speed limit, failure to buy a TV licence?
Perhaps we can do without any footballers, politicians, bankers etc etc