Just wondered what people on here thought would be a 'fair' price that Merry should pay for the stadium.
Personally I think the price should be based on what it cost (obvious really) with a reduction based on the amount of rent we have paid and the fact that Kassam got a very profitable leisure complex out of it all at a very cheap price - one that was supposed to help fund the stadium.
However, not knowing how much the stadium cost, profits made from the lesuire complex etc I don't feel qualified enough to put a figure on it.
I don't beleive that £17 million would be a fair price though - this seems to be more then it actually cost to build.
Going to sit in a stadium that we've paid over the odds for whilst having the lesuire complex on view all the time would stick in the throat somewhat.
How much for the stadium?
£10 million is about right and what I'd expect Kassam to ask for. He may be persuaded to come down a bit more than this.
Based on the latest accounts (which are a year old) the Stad Co has never made a profit (loses about 200k per year). Its probably worth as a going concern and an asset that you could raise money against less than £5 million but the two things that increase the value are the need for OUFC to have a stadium to continue playing and the fact that it has outstanding loans from its construction that are higher than this amount.
It owed the bank and other Firoka companies just over £7 million at the end of last financial year so this is effectively a bare minimum that Kassam would ever accept. BTW These debts are secured against other Firoka businesses because the stadium itself isn't enough security to lend that sort of money against.
If it has started to trade in the black and make a profit over the last 12 months then this could push the price up a bit over the £10 million. Say £12 million max.
Based on the latest accounts (which are a year old) the Stad Co has never made a profit (loses about 200k per year). Its probably worth as a going concern and an asset that you could raise money against less than £5 million but the two things that increase the value are the need for OUFC to have a stadium to continue playing and the fact that it has outstanding loans from its construction that are higher than this amount.
It owed the bank and other Firoka companies just over £7 million at the end of last financial year so this is effectively a bare minimum that Kassam would ever accept. BTW These debts are secured against other Firoka businesses because the stadium itself isn't enough security to lend that sort of money against.
If it has started to trade in the black and make a profit over the last 12 months then this could push the price up a bit over the £10 million. Say £12 million max.
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SuperOx
Stad Co.
The last set of numbers posted by Stad. Co. for the year ended 1/7/05
show that it has "liabilities" of £11M including an interesting figure of more than £2M to other Firoka companies.
Post interest charges,this business loses circa £200K and probably also
includes some doubtful items in the top line turnover figure in my opinion which is football related and is probably double counted in the grand scheme of things.
Kind see FK wanting anything less than £12M to be honest.
I see Merry injecting half and half from Harlequins RLFC in due course.
show that it has "liabilities" of £11M including an interesting figure of more than £2M to other Firoka companies.
Post interest charges,this business loses circa £200K and probably also
includes some doubtful items in the top line turnover figure in my opinion which is football related and is probably double counted in the grand scheme of things.
Kind see FK wanting anything less than £12M to be honest.
I see Merry injecting half and half from Harlequins RLFC in due course.
But £2.25 million of the liabilities is deferred grant income. Presumably as long as the stadium remains in use as a football stadium then this is out of the equation. I'm guessing that this money has long since been spent and its just shown in the balance sheet as a liability for accounting purposes because theoretically it could have to be paid back. Take that off and you're back to £10 million.
Effectively the £7 million is a loan from another Firoka company because it is cross secured against Firoka (Kings Cross) Limited.
Effectively the £7 million is a loan from another Firoka company because it is cross secured against Firoka (Kings Cross) Limited.
Well it was being discussed on here before the goals for year one came out.
And I also think its key in moving the club forward. Just what is the sticking point. Kassam said he wanted to sell the two together, is he playing silly beggers with the price or do Merry and co really not want (or cannot afford) the stadium.
If we don't own the stadium we may as well have stayed at the Manor.
And I also think its key in moving the club forward. Just what is the sticking point. Kassam said he wanted to sell the two together, is he playing silly beggers with the price or do Merry and co really not want (or cannot afford) the stadium.
If we don't own the stadium we may as well have stayed at the Manor.
A good question, Mr Cobb, about what the sticking point is over the Grenoble Road site.
My understanding from OV and others is that whoever or whatever is backing Merry financially had already agreed a price with Kassam for the stadium, but I’ve not seen that confirmed anywhere in print (please correct me as I could be wrong) by either Merry or Kassam - and we certainly don’t know what this figure is (though I have a decent idea of what the land alone is worth).
And yes, of course it does worry me a bit when the purchase of the Stadium seems to have slipped off the agenda for Year One (officially) as I and others were led to believe that this was a major consideration in moving the club forward.
In my worst nightmare it turns out that Merry is just the Chief Exec that Kassam had been nagged by FOUL and others to appoint 5 years ago, and that Firoz is still really in control of Oxford United’s destiny. But hey, we all have nightmares and they rarely come true..
My understanding from OV and others is that whoever or whatever is backing Merry financially had already agreed a price with Kassam for the stadium, but I’ve not seen that confirmed anywhere in print (please correct me as I could be wrong) by either Merry or Kassam - and we certainly don’t know what this figure is (though I have a decent idea of what the land alone is worth).
And yes, of course it does worry me a bit when the purchase of the Stadium seems to have slipped off the agenda for Year One (officially) as I and others were led to believe that this was a major consideration in moving the club forward.
In my worst nightmare it turns out that Merry is just the Chief Exec that Kassam had been nagged by FOUL and others to appoint 5 years ago, and that Firoz is still really in control of Oxford United’s destiny. But hey, we all have nightmares and they rarely come true..
Well whilst Kassam owns the stadium he still remains in control of our destiny.
This should not be allowed to be swept under the carpet, I do not see much of a future for OUFC if we are not playing in our own stadium and I cannot see how 'United' we can feel when we are willingly paying money to someone who has got a very nice leisure complex out of OUFC.
This should not be allowed to be swept under the carpet, I do not see much of a future for OUFC if we are not playing in our own stadium and I cannot see how 'United' we can feel when we are willingly paying money to someone who has got a very nice leisure complex out of OUFC.
Re:
I think we'll sell more than that and according to Merry's meeting with OxVox there was provision in the rental agrement for the rent to drop if we were relegated."Anonymous" wrote:Indeed, and the majority, if not all (assuming we sell around 1500), of the season ticket sales will be spent on the Stadium rent for the year. And we know who’s pocket that goes into!
However the fact that Kassam still owns the stadium and the way some people associated with the club have referred to him since the takeover by WPL is a fairly precarious situation for a football club to be in.
Kassam puts no store in goodwill or sentimentality. It is one of his biggest failings as a business man and human being. If he can get a better business deal by screwing the football club then he'll have no second thoughts about doing it. The only time he does let emotion get in the way is if he is attacked - we've all seen the outbursts in the press and at open meetings when this happens. Smith and Merry have done well not to criticise him openly so far but they need to get some of their hangers on and employees on message.
Chris, that’s naughty because you probably know I can’t go into details about that just yet because it’s still being chewed over by the Audit Commission and the Information Commissioner.
However, I will say that it would be worth considerably more for houses than for its (currently designated) leisure use, so if you were to squash the stadium and put up some nice social houses then you could probably make up your own mind about how much the site is worth by looking in the window of a local Estate Agent for the price a plot of land big enough to put a dwelling on and multiplying that by 300 or so.
However, I will say that it would be worth considerably more for houses than for its (currently designated) leisure use, so if you were to squash the stadium and put up some nice social houses then you could probably make up your own mind about how much the site is worth by looking in the window of a local Estate Agent for the price a plot of land big enough to put a dwelling on and multiplying that by 300 or so.
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Old Abingdonian
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I agree with Mally's assessment of Kassam - no sentiment, and so KassStad is worth what he will let it go for.
However, I would think he would be quite glad to get shot of it, if only because the adverse publicity can only have a negative effect on his other businesses, and he probably has a little vanity like most of his ilk.
We have to trust that Merry has not been daft enough to sign a blank rent cheque. Equally, we know from how things have already gone that a price may already have been agreed, and an announcement deferred for publicity or accountancy reasons.
However, I would think he would be quite glad to get shot of it, if only because the adverse publicity can only have a negative effect on his other businesses, and he probably has a little vanity like most of his ilk.
We have to trust that Merry has not been daft enough to sign a blank rent cheque. Equally, we know from how things have already gone that a price may already have been agreed, and an announcement deferred for publicity or accountancy reasons.
"But that is pure supposition, ‘cos it’s all secret, init? "
Things like this have always been secret at OUFC, all the details were a secret when Kassam took over. That was generally ok though, as Snake was party to those secrets.
I'd like to know too, but then I'd always like to know. Actually finding out is almost impossible until sometime after the event.
"What is certain is that a lot of the negative anti-Kassam stuff being put out by people like Jon Murray won’t be helping, because as Mally says he does like to get emotional when attacked, and that’s not going to help the deal - and let’s face it, he’s not exactly pushed for readies. "
This was put forward as a reason not to demonstrate as well, it was thought it'd make Kassam more defensive and less keen to sell. As it turned out, almost the opposite happened, one minor demonstration and he sold up, fast. I don't think he enjoys the bad publicity at all, I think the biggest weapon the supporters have is the ability to make things very uncomfortable for Kassam. Many on here seem to treat him as some sort of divine god for whom we must not upset, in case he thus rains down great fury on us and our families. That, frankly, is b'llocks.
Things like this have always been secret at OUFC, all the details were a secret when Kassam took over. That was generally ok though, as Snake was party to those secrets.
I'd like to know too, but then I'd always like to know. Actually finding out is almost impossible until sometime after the event.
"What is certain is that a lot of the negative anti-Kassam stuff being put out by people like Jon Murray won’t be helping, because as Mally says he does like to get emotional when attacked, and that’s not going to help the deal - and let’s face it, he’s not exactly pushed for readies. "
This was put forward as a reason not to demonstrate as well, it was thought it'd make Kassam more defensive and less keen to sell. As it turned out, almost the opposite happened, one minor demonstration and he sold up, fast. I don't think he enjoys the bad publicity at all, I think the biggest weapon the supporters have is the ability to make things very uncomfortable for Kassam. Many on here seem to treat him as some sort of divine god for whom we must not upset, in case he thus rains down great fury on us and our families. That, frankly, is b'llocks.