Points deduction

[SmileyMan]

It occurred to me that you could use a reductio ad absurdum argument to point out the errors in the current rules, along the lines of asking the BSP what the penalty would be for a team that fielded 11 ineligible players in a match that they lost?

However, the fact that the rules are stupid doesn't meant that we didn't break them. Let it be, and just work harder to overcome the deficit on the pitch. 5 points is equivalent to conceding a late goal to a set piece at 0-0 and 1-0, something which we've done plenty of in the past.

If all the keyboard warriors could put the same effort into supporting the manager and the players on the pitch, perhaps we can continue the good run and get into the playoffs despite the deduction?

[theox]

Would you not be gutted if we failed to reach the play offs as a result of an increased penalty following an appeal?

I think that this is a point that most people are missing.

Would you not be gutted if we didn’t appeal and we failed to reach the playoffs by five points or less?

And it’s not “most

[amershamwrighty]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/footbal ... 845421.stm

Hmmmm.......

[The OXman Cometh]

Right so the league are going to do their own internal inquiry, so any points deduction will be held off until after they have finished their inquiry, right?

[Kernow Yellow]

I think that this is a point that most people are missing.

Another point that many people are missing is that we don't have any indication of whether the club believe they are guilty (or not) of the charges?

All this 'we must appeal because the Conference appear to be incompetent' stuff is getting a little tiresome.

[Sideshow Rob]

I would appeal because:

a) It is the right thing to do for the four clubs unlucky enough to have been found guilty and all the others. We should appeal on the basis that the BSP are guilty of malpractice and be forced to reform their registration rules and procedures.

b) I would be personally gutted if we fail to reach the play-offs due to the points deduction.

Would you not be gutted if we failed to reach the play offs as a result of an increased penalty following an appeal?

I think it is very unlikely that the FA would insist that we take a penalty for an administrative error like this that would be greater than they would impose on a club entering administration. The appeal is well worth a punt.

[Snake]

I think that this is a point that most people are missing.

Another point that many people are missing is that we don't have any indication of whether the club believe they are guilty (or not) of the charges?

All this 'we must appeal because the Conference appear to be incompetent' stuff is getting a little tiresome.

I don’t think anyone has missed that point, Kernow. We do know that the club were partly at fault, but the level of the transgression is miniscule compared to the penalty we may have to suffer.

So, who’s side are you on here? I mean, you’re beginning to sound like OxVox. “Oh, we don’t know. Maybe we should do this, maybe we should do that. Can’t we just comment on it after the event?

[Matt D]

[quote=&quotSnake&quot]So, who’s side are you on here? I mean, you’re beginning to sound like OxVox. “Oh, we don’t know. Maybe we should do this, maybe we should do that. Can’t we just comment on it after the event?

[Brahma Bull]

[quote=&quotSnake&quot]I mean, you’re beginning to sound like OxVox. “Oh, we don’t know. Maybe we should do this, maybe we should do that. Can’t we just comment on it after the event?

[ty cobb]

I’ve kept quiet about this issue, mainly because I can’t see anything that has confirmed what exactly it is that we’ve done wrong. Faxing in some information and then not checking up on it is far better then never faxing the information in the first place.

For me to comment on whether we should appeal is therefore somewhat of a moot point as I’ve no idea to what extent we’ve been at fault, if any at all.

However, with the Conference now investigating their own procedures and reportedly having changed them during the season risks this whole thing dragging out and becoming somewhat of a farce. I think this investigation should be completed before any appeal deadline passes – how on Earth could an appeal be heard without the Conference knowing whether their procedures are sufficient or not? If the investigation reveals that in fact the working practices were fine and there was no good reason why 3 clubs from the same league have faced the same problems then I would suggest we were at fault and would stand little chance in any appeal. However, if it reveals shortcomings in the procedures and areas for improvement this would massively help our appeal.

This does however, risk dragging this whole issue on and causes uncertainty for all clubs in the Conference – how can a club approach a match when a draw could be sufficient should Crawley and Oxford get points deducted but a win would be needed otherwise?

I also don’t feel this wait and see approach depending on how many points we’ve picked up is really in the spirit of the game. If we have a genuine case then appeal. If we don’t, but we could do with the points to get in the play offs then this seems to me to be wasting the Conferences time, and the supporter’s time.

Personally I think if we can show beyond any reasonable doubt that we did send something in then we should not be deducted points. We have a player who has played for us for the last 2 seasons, we held his registration, was registered at the FA and we were not seeking to gain any advantage in playing him. To be deducted half the points of going into administration for this is completely out of proportion and smacks of heavy handiness – just what is this trying to achieve??

[slappy]

Just for info, when i first ticked No to the appeal, it was on the basis that OUFC had cocked up and were lucky to get away with 5 let alone 11.

Now it transpires that the Conferences systems for checking player registrations were wholly inadequate at the time, unfit for purpose, not appropriate for a professional league let alone the Morrells Sunday league, the penalties out of all proportion to the offence (even under a strict liability basis). I would say Yes to the appeal if asked today, particularly as we've got 6 points from 2 games and are dangerously close to the play-offs and far enough away from the drop zone. .

I emailed the FA yesterday to let them know my thoughts, and that if they have any jurisdiction over the mickey mouse league we are in, they should overturn these points deductions for all 4 clubs affected.

[Snake]

[quote=&quotMatt D&quot][quote=&quotSnake&quot]So, who’s side are you on here? I mean, you’re beginning to sound like OxVox. “Oh, we don’t know. Maybe we should do this, maybe we should do that. Can’t we just comment on it after the event?

[Dr Bob]

If the investigation reveals that in fact the working practices were fine and there was no good reason why 3 clubs from the same league have faced the same problems then I would suggest we were at fault and would stand little chance in any appeal. However, if it reveals shortcomings in the procedures and areas for improvement this would massively help our appeal.

I agree with everything you say - but I do wonder......If the investigation goes as far as reaching the latter point you make here, I would hope this would result in the Conference returning the deducted points to all affected clubs. Or do I need to get out of Cloud Cuckoo Land as fast as my little legs will carry me?

[Isaac]

I think this &quotinternal investigation&quot by the conference means the club actually have to appeal. Based on wanting to wait for the outcome of the internal investigation if nothing else.

If they don't they're accepting the 5 point penalty, which would be rather stupid if the internal investigation discovered that the registration process is horribly flawed and missing registrations were not the fault of the clubs.

[Geoff]

Hark - is that a cuckoo 'pon yonder bough?