Rubbish

Anything yellow and blue
GodalmingYellow
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Rubbish

Post by GodalmingYellow »

Rubbish
Rubbish
Rubbish
slappy
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Re: Rubbish

Post by slappy »

&quotGodalmingYellow&quot wrote:Rubbish
Rubbish
Rubbish
enough about the one-sided ref, how do you think OUFC performed?
GodalmingYellow
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Re: Rubbish

Post by GodalmingYellow »

&quotslappy&quot wrote:
&quotGodalmingYellow&quot wrote:Rubbish
Rubbish
Rubbish
enough about the one-sided ref, how do you think OUFC performed?
We can't blame the ref for that shambles. Worst result of the season, and at least on a par with the Crawley debacle. And the sad thing is, that even for the 10 minutes (no Chris, it wasn't 25 minutes) that we attacked Cheltenham, they looked mediocre defensively.

Wilder has to take some blame for signing far too many sub-standard strikers (and players generally), and not signing sufficient cover in important positions on the pitch, like at centre back.

No one is going to persuade me that Crawley, Southend, and Cheltenham have bigger budgets than us, bearing in mind that the player budget is capped in relation to turnover. If other teams sign better players on a lower budget, then that is pretty much solely down to the Manager. The fact is that of this season's signings, only Duberry, Leven and Robbie Hall are good enough, and that is a shocking waste of a big budget for this division.

We only got as high as third, because we had a run against some very poor teams.

Those demons are just beginning to niggle that possibly Wilder has taken us as far as he can. I hope they are wrong.
Joey's Toe
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Re: Rubbish

Post by Joey's Toe »

No fault of the ref (the sending off was correct, and none of the three goals were more attributable to his errors than ours). But equally, let's not get carried away with criticism of our own lot.

It's been a terrible November, but it was also a month of very tough games. We were in a false position at the start of the month, as we'd not played many of the top sides. Now we have, we find out what many of us said at the start of the season - we're a mid-table side.

With the injuries we've got, there's even an argument that we're now in a false position the other way. When Duberry and Potter are back, when Capaldi is fit, and when Craddock et al can play a fuller part, we might yet put things right.

All this talk about player budgets etc is nonsense. If it's just down to budgets, let's just print the balance statements of every club on a Saturday, and save ourselves going to a match at all. Bradford probably have the biggest budget in this league, and look where they are.

What the success of Cheltenham, Southend etc shows is that any side can have a go if they get it right. Are we so far off getting it right that we need the doom and gloom?

Yesterday, we had a lot of average players (Whing, Worley) covering for better ones. We had a (deserved, but unhelpful) sending off. We had blustery conditions which made life hard for us in the first half. We had low confidence going into the game. We had a poor referee (to both sides, yes, but it doesn't help the flow of the game).

But some of the numpties texting crap like &quotMagilton in&quot to RadOx after the game have short memories and make me ashamed to be an OUFC fan.
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Post by Ancient Colin »

Does anyone seriously think that we lost that because of the refereeing? I'm not saying he was good, he was badly inconsistent and made some poor decisions. But those bad decisions were by no means all against us. And it was hardly causal.

Another thing that gets lost in the loans / signings issue is that surely the role of a manager, particularly at our level, is to develop players (and a side) not simply to acquire them and discard them. Teams like Cheltenham (bigger than us, faster than us, making better decisions than us, knowing what is expected of themselves, wanting it more than us) are created not simply assembled.

I've missed a lot of recent matches: I was shocked at how badly we've gone backwards. Confidence shot, Duberry missing, OK, but much of the pass and move play seems to have disappeared, basic skills deteriorated, pattern lost. Add that to the usual gripes (do they ever practice throw ins? do they ever discuss throw ins? if you are being overrun and outpowered in midfield does it make sense to remove a midfielder and throw on a forward? what's with the &quotplaying statues&quot set piece defence?), it didn't make for an edifying afternoon.

When did Robbie Hall become a four year old toddler hurling himself to the floor and bawling when he doesn't get his way?

How on earth was Leven &quotman of the match&quot?
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Post by neilw »

Had that goal line clearance crossed the line and their free kick not deflected, would we be talking about the fighting spirit of 10 men who came back to earn a draw?
Dr Bob
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Post by Dr Bob »

In the first half, it was noticeable just how few headers our front players won from long balls forward. That height advantage, to me, was also reflected in the greater physical strength of the Cheltenham players all over the pitch, as well as their greater level of basic ball skills (Batt was torn to shreds in that first 45 minutes -Whing was repeatedly being pulled out of position because he had to go over and cover) and their greater desire.

In that first half I thought the ref was better than average (look, I know that is not saying much, OK?!), because it was a relief to have a ref that did not blow up every time a player went over. In that first half I thought Cheltenham made it look men against boys. And Hall's falling over and Guy's refusing to retreat at that one free kick just showed how poor the players' whole mindset and attitude was.

Did we come into the match late on because we suddenly started to play better? Or because Cheltenham took their collective foot off the pedal? Does it matter? What does matter, to me, as others have already said, is that recent results show us to be a mid-table side or, to put it another way, we simply have not progressed from last season.

I have been to very few matches lately, but my sense from the ones I have seen and the reports I have read about the others, is that we struggle to score, we lose one defender and suddenly cannot defend at all, we lose a wide player and suddenly cannot create chances any more, we very rarely close out games even when playing well, and in our last two league games we were not just beaten but humbled, stuffed, outplayed.

Even when we were winning, reports on here of matches I did not go to suggested players' confidence was still fragile? Why? What is going on that this should be the case in the good times? And if indeed it is so, how the hell are things going to be turned around given our current form?
YF Dan
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Re: Rubbish

Post by YF Dan »

&quotslappy&quot wrote:
&quotGodalmingYellow&quot wrote:Rubbish
Rubbish
Rubbish
enough about the one-sided ref, how do you think OUFC performed?
We must be the unluckiest team in the world to have referees pick on us every week.

Here's a thought for you to mull on: perhaps, just perhaps, we - the fans - are the biased ones, not the referees?

----

Can anyone on this forum justify Lewis Guy going straight into the first team?
theox
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Re: Rubbish

Post by theox »

&quotYF Dan&quot wrote:
&quotslappy&quot wrote:
&quotGodalmingYellow&quot wrote:Rubbish
Rubbish
Rubbish
enough about the one-sided ref, how do you think OUFC performed?
We must be the unluckiest team in the world to have referees pick on us every week.

Here's a thought for you to mull on: perhaps, just perhaps, we - the fans - are the biased ones, not the referees?

----

Can anyone on this forum justify Lewis Guy going straight into the first team?
I think it is correct that he is a Premiership ref? Therefore, we can't even rely on the 'refs are crap/overawed by our ground/crowd at this level' argument.....

I think the game confirmed that we have not progressed from last year. We generally beat the poor teams and generally get outplayed by the good ones. I note that GY said that the demons are beginning to niggle about Wilder having taken us as far as he can - I actually relayed the same fear to my father after the game. If his reaction to every defeat or poor run is simply to bring in more loan players then I can't see things turning around. I used to odopt the same tactic on Football Manager and it didn't work on there either!!!

Hopefully we can get all the injured players back soon, get a settled team, and finally see how good we really are with an actual 1st XI.
slappy
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Post by slappy »

I thought the referee didn't really get decisions wrong as such, he just seemed to penalise us more, and there were several occasions when he could have booked Cheltenham players and didn't.

As for the game, their goalkeeper made three extremely fine saves, and there was also a goalline clearance. Their first goal was good quality and perhaps a bit lucky, but the last should have been better defended by the wall. The one off the bar was worthy of a goal. If we had got back to 2-2 I think we could have clung on.
Peterorange
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Post by Peterorange »

Don't get to many games these days, but I was there Saturday for my son's birthday treat :roll: and was struck by how quiet the fans were from the kick off. Strange to hear the Cheltenham fans singing 'can you hear the Oxford sing' after only 20 minutes.

One of the worst Oxford games I have seen in 20 years. Cheltenham kicked off at 3, Oxford didn't kick off until 3.30. Not sure whether Wilder actually gave a team talk or had them listening to Enya before the game. Then we didn't even try to play that game where you pass the ball around to each other but just hoofed it up to Beano's head. Even on one occasion, to Robbie Hall's (where is the head-bang-against-wall smiley?). Ref was awful but we were worse. There didn't seem to be anyone in midfield wanting the ball in the early stages, the defence would bring the ball out but have no choice to punt it down the wings.

Last 25 we started playing but way too late.
OUFC4eva
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Re:

Post by OUFC4eva »

&quotDr Bob&quot wrote:That height advantage, to me, was also reflected in the greater physical strength of the Cheltenham players all over the pitch, as well as their greater level of basic ball skills (Batt was torn to shreds in that first 45 minutes - Whing was repeatedly being pulled out of position because he had to go over and cover) and their greater desire.
I am glad you made that observation about Batt's performance.

I too thought that he had a diabolical game. He seems to get targeted by opposing teams who spot that he is frail defensively both in the air and on the floor. Whing scares me to death too. His lack of pace is scary but he should not have to cover so much for the ineffectual Batt.

Batt fans will pull me up and say: &quotHey, he's the best right back&quot in this God awful league. That's not saying much and I refute that anyway.
Old Abingdonian
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Post by Old Abingdonian »

I'm trying to take a balanced view of what was one of the most disappointing performances of the Wilder era. Yes, we can turn it round, yes we did play better with ten men, yes, we were unlucky to a degree.

But there are two things which have a significance beyond this game. The first is our awful start. Not for the first time, a side which CW said were fired up to put recent defeats behind them were slow, apparently uninterested and tactically clueless on the rare occasions we got the ball. Why? The second is the 'players per pound' issue. And I can't agree with Joey's Toe: I'm glad that it is only in the Premiership that bank balance guarantees success, but it is fair to point out that Mark Yates appears to have a group of players with no great performance history behind them playing better than us. So either our higher salaries enable us to attract better players who are not performing, or we have not got value for money. Or a bit of each.
GodalmingYellow
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Re:

Post by GodalmingYellow »

&quotOUFC4eva&quot wrote:
&quotDr Bob&quot wrote:That height advantage, to me, was also reflected in the greater physical strength of the Cheltenham players all over the pitch, as well as their greater level of basic ball skills (Batt was torn to shreds in that first 45 minutes - Whing was repeatedly being pulled out of position because he had to go over and cover) and their greater desire.
I am glad you made that observation about Batt's performance.

I too thought that he had a diabolical game. He seems to get targeted by opposing teams who spot that he is frail defensively both in the air and on the floor. Whing scares me to death too. His lack of pace is scary but he should not have to cover so much for the ineffectual Batt.

Batt fans will pull me up and say: &quotHey, he's the best right back&quot in this God awful league. That's not saying much and I refute that anyway.
I'm definitely a fan of Batt, and he is the best wing back in this division, by a country mile, but he was awful against Cheltenham. I won't criticise him for Crawley because he was played in a silly position in a silly formation.

I too don't understand the point JT is trying to make. Clubs pay players higher wages because they are better players, or because the manager is crap and doesn't understand what each player is worth and negotiates badly. So either Wilder has done a bad job of paying for players, or a bad job motivating them to get a performance like on Saturday.

We have a budget way beyond pretty much anyone in the division, so there is no excuse for multiple players who simply are not good enough. I repeat, only Robbie Hall, Leven and Duberry are of acceptable standard of this season's signings. That isn't good enough from Wilder. Not even close.

I can live with the plan A 4-3-3 formation when we play well and pass it about. And we should stick to that formation and let others worry about us if that is Wilder's preferred formation. Only when that looks like going wrong during a game should it be changed. Often when we get closed down quickly, or play against a physical side, or against a counter attacking side, we struggle to get to grips, and Wilder's plan B is to change formation and play everyone out of position, rather than buying good quality players who can play in more than one position, and changing the shape sensibly. I really don't think this is too much to ask for.

And please don't anyone bring up high rent as an excuse. It isn't a valid argument, and accounts for only £2 of each ticket price, and our ticket prices are high compared to other teams, and would be far worse if we owned the ground based on Kassam's asking price. All clubs have to pay for their stadiums, whether it be mortgage or rent, and our gates and ticket prices are far ahead of other teams, so that this is just not an issue.
Joey's Toe
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Re:

Post by Joey's Toe »

Don't disagree with much of what you've said.

To clarify my point on wages - I just think that to boil one's expectation levels down to budget is simplistic, because so many other factors come into play. As others have said on this thread, Wilder's ability to get average players playing better is the critical ability at this level. I think that players like Davis, Worley, Smalley and Batt have the potential to be playing much much better than they are currently - and if they do so, we'll be in the mix. The question is whether Wilder can mould them into better players. That's where the real issue lies, in my opinion.
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