'A Historic Speech' vs 'An Historic Speech'

SteMerritt · Post by **SteMerritt** » Fri Jun 19, 2009 2:02 pm

Sorry, completely random for a normal football forum, but this is Rage Online!

On the racist section of TiU there is a thread called &quotA Historic Speech&quot. As there are some forum members on here very well versed in gramatical correctness, could someone point me out the correct version of the 2 options &quotA Historic Speech&quot and &quotAn Historic Speech&quot please. Both are generally used, but which is correct? I would tend to use the second, which is why I queried it, but I have never claimed my English skills to be of a particularly high standard.

Cheers.

A-Ro · Post by **A-Ro** » Fri Jun 19, 2009 2:04 pm

&quotAn 'istoric&quot for me.

Werthers Original · Post by **Werthers Original** » Fri Jun 19, 2009 2:05 pm

It's 'A Historic Speech'. You wouldn't say 'An horse' (well some of the TIU crowd probably would).

They've got a special racist section now??

A-Ro · Post by **A-Ro** » Fri Jun 19, 2009 2:12 pm

&quotWerthers Original&quot wrote:It's 'A Historic Speech'. You wouldn't say 'An horse' (well some of the TIU crowd probably would).

They've got a special racist section now??

But you do book an 'otel.

SteMerritt · Post by **SteMerritt** » Fri Jun 19, 2009 2:19 pm

True, always 'A Horse'.

Instances of 'An Historic'

http://www.edinburgh.org/capital/
http://www.lamp.ac.uk/news/press_releas ... eated.html
http://www.animalaid.org.uk/h/n/NEWS/ne ... /ALL/1737/

...there are loads of examples like this. Is it just mass ignorance then?

chuckbert · Post by **chuckbert** » Fri Jun 19, 2009 2:20 pm

I haven't got anything to back this up, but when I was a kid my Dad told me that with an 'H' noun, you use 'an' if it is a word with a French root (an hotel) but 'a' for others (a hostel). Don't really know what that means for 'historic', though.

SteMerritt · Post by **SteMerritt** » Fri Jun 19, 2009 2:26 pm

This suggests that both forms are correct...

http&#58//www&#46betterwritingskills&#4 ... 05&#46html

...but it appears to be an Australian site, so what do they know!

Werthers Original · Post by **Werthers Original** » Fri Jun 19, 2009 2:27 pm

Upper-class people didn't use to pronounce the initial h in some words, esp French ones, but that's obsolete now - 'an historic' seems to be some kind of hypercorrect hangover. Don't know why it's persisted with just that word, you don't hear 'an 'otel' much any more from genteel folk.

Matt D · Post by **Matt D** » Fri Jun 19, 2009 3:23 pm

why not ask these lovely people?

A-Ro · Post by **A-Ro** » Fri Jun 19, 2009 5:47 pm

&quotMatt D&quot wrote:why not ask these lovely people?

&quot(which is now often regarded as distinctly old-fashioned)&quot

That's me that is.

Anyway, what would you do if you found this while you were proof reading boris?

boris · Post by **boris** » Fri Jun 19, 2009 5:55 pm

If I found it while proof reading I'd probably leave it as it was printed. If I found it while copy editing I'd probably write it as &quota historic speech&quot if it was a fairly informal piece, or &quotan historic speech&quot if it was a more formal work. However, I'd also check the text for consistency to decide whether the author preferred one form over the other.

Snake · Post by **Snake** » Sun Jun 21, 2009 10:10 pm

I think there is a fair amount of debate in relation to this issue, but IÔÇÖm with the black guy.

Kernow Yellow · Post by **Kernow Yellow** » Mon Jun 22, 2009 10:12 am

Preceding 'h' words with 'an' is just an ostentatious affectation in my opinion.

'An hotel'. Really, I ask you.

A-Ro · Post by **A-Ro** » Mon Jun 22, 2009 10:25 am

&quotKernow Yellow&quot wrote:Preceding 'h' words with 'an' is just an ostentatious affectation in my opinion.

'An hotel'. Really, I ask you.

Its &quotan 'otel&quot

Dr Bob · Post by **Dr Bob** » Mon Jun 22, 2009 10:45 am

&quotKernow Yellow&quot wrote:Preceding 'h' words with 'an' is just an ostentatious affectation in my opinion.

'An hotel'. Really, I ask you.

To me, both orally and aurally &quotan 'otel&quot works better than &quota hotel&quot and &quota[y] hotel&quot (ie with either a short or long 'a'). It is smoother in sound and rolls off the tongue easier - and could therefore reasonably be considered the antithesis of an ostentatious affectation. Unless merely thinking of such things is ostentatious.....

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